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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Dec 03 2015 :  2:46:54 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Holy cow, does your consultant travel? Very exciting indeed, Caren. I'm all ears. This kind of work is the next step. I was just down taking Eliza Belle's temp because she's lethargic today and off her food. No fever. No gelling. No off-smelling discharge. When I hugged her to leave, I started crying unexpectedly. I knew in that instant that she's merely having a sad day.

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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Ron

4666 Posts
Ronnie
Peever SD
USA

Posted - Dec 03 2015 :  2:58:59 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yep was nice before all the organic...gmo...conventional....was all just called food !

One reason I like your products MJ....I trust where they come from :)

With a moo moo here and a moo moo there, here a moo, there a moo, everywhere a moo moo.
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txbikergirl

3197 Posts


Posted - Dec 03 2015 :  4:27:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
good to have you back ron

Firefly Hollow Farm , our little farmstead. Farmgirl living in the green piney woods of East Texas on 23 acres with a few jerseys, too many chickens, a pair of pugs and my Texan hubby (aka "lover boy")
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CloversMum

3486 Posts


Posted - Dec 03 2015 :  8:20:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Caren, can you tell us more about your consultant? What organization are they from? Seriously, do they travel??

Loving life and family on our Idaho farm, Meadowlark Heritage Farm; A few Jersey cows; a few alpacas; a few more goats, and even more ducks and chickens
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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  09:00:31 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Miss Daisy gave me the opportunity to try out my Mastoblast this morning. I'm looking forward to tomorrow to see if she responds. I also gave her plenty of Ester C.

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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NellieBelle

11074 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  09:58:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
MaryJane, Miss Daisy showed positive on her CMT? Well, this will be a good time to test the Mastoblast out. Sure hope it does the trick. I keep thinking one of my gals will show positive for mastitis with all the mud and yuck around here, but knock on wood, nothing has shown. Hoping the best for Miss Daisy.

To laugh is human but to moo is bovine. Author Unknown
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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  10:59:10 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, one of her cups gelled. It was perfectly clear yesterday. Lots of mud and muck around here also. Not only did she gel the cup, that quarter is swollen and a glob of yuck came out when I stripped her, a first for her. Drats.

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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NellieBelle

11074 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  11:26:18 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Well, I will be curious to see how the Mastoblast performs. I must admit, keeping and udder clean under these conditions is definitely a challenge.

To laugh is human but to moo is bovine. Author Unknown
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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  1:03:06 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I still think we need to diaper their butts and knit udder muffs that we line with plastic.

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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NellieBelle

11074 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  1:48:01 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Couldn't agree more. Give us time. :)

To laugh is human but to moo is bovine. Author Unknown
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NellieBelle

11074 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  1:55:09 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thinking more in the lines of a large canvas bag/washable bottom, like what we carry our milk machine in, to keep the udder from getting mud/muck on it. Straps to go up around the flank, so it can be easily removed at milking time. No plastic as it needs to breath. May be onto something. :) Maybe even dual purpose, weaning bag.

To laugh is human but to moo is bovine. Author Unknown

Edited by - NellieBelle on Dec 09 2015 2:35:09 PM
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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  2:45:00 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm all ears. And I have a heavy duty sewing machine.

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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NellieBelle

11074 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  2:50:13 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I actually think it may be doable. If we were closer I can only imagine the things we would come up with. :) Milk Cow Boutique

To laugh is human but to moo is bovine. Author Unknown

Edited by - NellieBelle on Dec 09 2015 2:51:52 PM
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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Dec 09 2015 :  4:21:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
No doubt a formidable milkmaid posse rounding up good ideas hither and yon. (No doubt the occasional hit-or-miss.)

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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CloversMum

3486 Posts


Posted - Dec 10 2015 :  09:39:08 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
You two could be dangerous with what you'd come up with! :-)

I'm thinking that a poo-catcher like Janet is describing could take the place of the super duper pooper scooper. It is a constant race to see if that yellow bucket can get placed just perfectly as Clover ready, aims, and fires! Clover doesn't always poop during milking now either, so the surprise factor plays into it.

And, I like the name, "Milk Cow Boutique."

Loving life and family on our Idaho farm, Meadowlark Heritage Farm; A few Jersey cows; a few alpacas; a few more goats, and even more ducks and chickens
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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Apr 15 2016 :  8:21:29 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I put in a call this past week to Idaho's Dairy Bureau to speak with the director of our state's raw milk program. Why? A graduate student at the U of I took raw milk samples from me last summer (I was milking Sally and Daisy at the time). She wanted to run tests to determine bad (e. Coli, etc.) and good bacterial colonies (probiotics). I told her I'd be happy to help on one condition. From the same batch of milk, I wanted her to run the exact same tests on my thermized milk (150 degrees for 15 seconds). The nasty bacteria we're all familiar with die at 145 degrees. Anyway, long story short, my raw milk "was exceedingly clean" (no bad bacteria) and had 9 colonies of probiotics. My thermized milk had 8 colonies of probiotics. "Essentially, they were the same," she said.

I think this finding is significant so I'd like to pursue more involved testing and called to find out if there is a laboratory who can help me. He didn't know of a laboratory off the top of his head but he did direct me to a rather large-scale raw milk dairy farmer in S. Idaho who he said is a "total class act," thinking he might be able to help me find a lab.

As I looked over his website, I thought some of you might be interested in what he has to say about quite a number of things.

For example:

"Many dairy cows may lose weight during the early stages of lactation due to energy requirements even with the best nutrition. If dairy cattle are not given the proper nutrition they need, they can get severely stressed and may be susceptible to infectious and metabolic diseases. Not only will the cow suffer, but also her milk production and quality. For example, ketosis and hypocalcemia are both common and quickly fatal metabolic diseases in dairy cattle that are caused by inadequate nutrition during lactation. Contrary to popular belief, year-round pasture feeding dairy cattle is NOT natural and is not the way dairy cattle have been historically managed. A good quality, high producing dairy cow cannot do well on green pasture alone. Even the best pasture does not contain the nutrition it needs to produce the milk it was bred to produce. Keep in mind that a grass fed dairy in Idaho only has grass available from April-Sept/Oct. Year round pasture feeding of dairy cattle requires the artificial creation of year-round pastures by intensive irrigation that uses high volumes of energy and water ... "

"Tim Boyd, a member of the WAP Foundation, comments on the subject of grassfeeding milking cows, "...[G]rass is very short on Phosphorus and calcium two of the three essential macro nutrients, and is very short on energy (starch) to give fuel to microbes to multiply to digest large amounts of protein. The average cow rations should be in the range of 16.5 percent protein, most grass we feed as pasture is 24 to 27% protein, essentially drowning the microbes in too much protein forcing the cow to starve given nothing or very little gets digested because the microbes have no energy to reproduce even though the cow eats constantly.... The key is to have the balance just right with dairy cows and that is very hard to do with grass, and remember we have the limited up take of calcium and phosphorus as mentioned earlier with grass alone.... WAPF to my knowledge has never promoted 100% grass fed given the two counties in the country that can do it cannot supply the country with products. Grass can be a good thing but it also can be abused and lead to the same results of CAFOs, just killing them with protein and instead of energy."

Here's his website:

http://www.idahofarmfresh.com/Our-Dairy.html

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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txbikergirl

3197 Posts


Posted - Apr 16 2016 :  8:20:49 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
how i see it maryjane is that i am artificially creating demands on the cows health by increasing their milk supply for my needs, so it makes sense that i need to add to her diet to compensate for that. i can't think that just "more" pasture will compensate for the increased production i created.

Firefly Hollow Farm , our little farmstead. Farmgirl living in the green piney woods of East Texas on 23 acres with a few jerseys, too many chickens, a pair of pugs and my Texan hubby (aka "lover boy")

Edited by - txbikergirl on Apr 16 2016 8:21:09 PM
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NellieBelle

11074 Posts


Posted - Apr 17 2016 :  05:36:39 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Great link MaryJane, and interesting findings with your milk. Did you read where they get their milk to 38 degrees in less than a minute from the time of milking? Great information to glean from. Thank you.

To laugh is human but to moo is bovine. Author Unknown
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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Apr 17 2016 :  09:09:07 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I agree Cindy. Cow lactation/pregnancies are all different just like women's pregnancies/lactations are different and it's our job to figure out what our cows need in order to give us milk.

When I got pregnant the first time I was alarmed by how much I wanted to eat. Subsequently, I gained 50 pounds. Within the first two months of nursing, I'd lost the weight I'd gained and proceeded to struggle to maintain "body condition." I kept getting very thin while giving milk for another two years. Toast and jam! Milkshakes! It was like that Meryl Streep 'Judgment City' movie where you can't gain weight (in heaven) and can finally eat all the pasta you want.

Some women need 1,500 to 2,000 and maybe even 3,000 calories/day just to produce milk. That's in addition to her own metabolic needs.

Janet, I did notice his procedure for 'down to 38 in nothin' flat.' Wouldn't that be nice. Must be an impressive vat cooler.

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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CloversMum

3486 Posts


Posted - Apr 21 2016 :  7:52:56 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
When I read the comment about "contrary to popular belief, cows do not pasture graze year round" (that was paraphrased), it reminded me of the Little House on the Prairie books where Ma would add carrot juice to make the butter yellow, but didn't need to during the spring when the cow was eating the new grasses. So, obviously, previous generations knew this and just recently there has been a push for grass-fed everything. I guess all must be in balance ... otherwise, you'll end up in the ditch on either side of the issue.

And, most definitely need to watch and respond to your own animal. Each cow is unique with their personality, nutritional needs, likes and dislikes. But we all should know and study regarding body condition ... what is good? What do you look for? etc.

Loving life and family on our Idaho farm, Meadowlark Heritage Farm; A few Jersey cows; a few alpacas; a few more goats, and even more ducks and chickens
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maryjane

6942 Posts


Posted - Apr 23 2016 :  10:17:52 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Body condition is somewhat intuitive I think, a result of handling a cow daily and knowing her for a length of time.

Here's a more scientific approach that I think is well written:

http://extension.psu.edu/animals/dairy/nutrition/nutrition-and-feeding/body-condition-scoring/body-condition-scoring-as-a-tool-for-dairy-herd-management

In it you'll read things like this:

Reproduction

"Energy balance plays a very important role in reproductive performance, and both current and past energy status influence a cow’s ability to reproduce. Greater change in BCS between calving and first breeding and lower BCS at the first breeding consistently are associated with reduced pregnancy rates. However, multiple studies have found that diet changes were not able to overcome BCS loss in early lactation, which means that the primary way to control BCS at breeding is to manage BCS at calving.

A Cornell study published in 1989 provides a good example of the impact of BCS on reproduction. In the study three groups of dry cows were monitored to determine the effect of body condition during the dry period on subsequent reproductive performance. Cows with the highest BCS at calving lost the most body condition in the first 5 weeks of lactation. These cows had a longer interval to first ovulation, a higher number of days to first heat and conception, and the lowest first-service conception rates (Table 1). Losing body condition during early gestation has also been associated with increased embryonic losses. For the farmer, these factors mean lost dollars."

MaryJane Butters, author of Milk Cow Kitchen ~ striving for the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain ~
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CloversMum

3486 Posts


Posted - Apr 24 2016 :  11:47:43 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Some notes that I copied from the article that MaryJane provided a link to:

The goal is to minimize weight loss by encouraging intake of high quality, highly palatable forage dry matter at a rate of 1.8 to 2.0% of body weight per day, with grain supplemented to support milk production.

If regaining body condition is delayed past 80 to 120 days, cows will often have reduced fertility. The nutritional program should encourage moderate weight gain (0.75 to 1 pound per day) that will support milk production and fertility, but avoid excessive weight gain.

I need more visual to figure out body condition scoring on cows ... this article talks about having a video on it so I'll have to look it up.

Loving life and family on our Idaho farm, Meadowlark Heritage Farm; A few Jersey cows; a few alpacas; a few more goats, and even more ducks and chickens
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farmlife

1413 Posts


Posted - Apr 24 2016 :  9:47:47 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Tell me if you find the video, Charlene. I needed the visual too.
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CloversMum

3486 Posts


Posted - Apr 24 2016 :  10:23:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here's one youtube link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZJat_LIB6c

At the four minute mark the different numbers 1-5 are explained.

Another one that was even better:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfIFYr1UPls

This one was short but it showed actual cows for each number which helped me a bunch.

Loving life and family on our Idaho farm, Meadowlark Heritage Farm; A few Jersey cows; a few alpacas; a few more goats, and even more ducks and chickens
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farmlife

1413 Posts


Posted - Apr 25 2016 :  04:51:06 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks, Charlene!
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